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Most people who went to a CSU Channel Islands public meeting Tuesday about the future of a park there said they want what they already have.
University Park, known until recently as Camarillo Regional Park, is a 367-acre expanse near the campus entrance that the county gave to CSUCI in 2009. It is undeveloped except for an asphalt runway and other facilities used to fly radio-controlled model airplanes. There also is a pond popular with model- boat owners.
The plane and boat hobbyists are nervous about what the university may do with the property, and they made up almost the entire crowd at the forum at the campus. They want to preserve the facilities they've built and the access they've enjoyed for the past 25 years.
"You have a jewel sitting there in this recreation facility," said Jeffrey Sandler of North Hollywood. "It's outrageous what's happening here, that it's being ignored."
The forum was scheduled for a library classroom but had to be moved to a nearby auditorium when more than 200 people showed up. Except for a few hikers and bird watchers, all the visitors said they were from model-boat or model-plane clubs.
"We've heard you loud and clear," said John Gormley, CSUCI's director of planning, design and construction and a member of a university committee studying the park. "Your largest concern is maintaining an operational air strip, and we appreciate that."
But there was some dispute about whether the airstrip will be in the university's long-term plans. The deed to the property specifies that the park be used for "passive recreation."
"I don't think of what we do as passive, and I'd like to know what your definition of 'passive recreation' is," Sandler said.
Caroline Doll, chairwoman of CSUCI's University Park committee, said it hasn't found a precise definition of "passive recreation" and whether it includes model boats and airplanes.
Final decisions about the park will be made at CSU headquarters, she said. The committee's work, including Tuesday's hearing and other efforts to gauge public opinion, will help inform that decision.
"The CSU trustees own the property," Doll said. "We don't have the power to tell you exactly what's going to happen here."
The university has ruled out serious development of the property. While in county hands, it was mentioned as a site for a golf course, jail or concert amphitheater.
Likely ideas now include new restrooms and improved hiking trails, perhaps with a connection to trails in the Santa Monica Mountains. The park will be open to the public with some parking available. Currently, anyone can walk onto the property, but only members of the model-boat and model-airplane clubs have keys to open the gates to cars.
The university also plans to use the land to study wetlands environments and restore the area "to a more natural condition," said Don Rodriguez, a member of the committee and chairman of CSUCI's environmental science and management program.
"The challenge we have is: How do you balance use with protection and preservation? That's always a challenge, but I think it's very doable here," he said.
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Comments » 37
sslocal writes:
They tossed the shooters out now the airplane guys will have to go. Seems as if the university may not have been a good idea as far as these groups are concerned.
5thgenvcresident writes:
I know Prof. Rodriguez well and he's a strong advocate for pursuing outcomes that are successful in meeting the needs of multiple stakeholders involved in projects like these. It would be a great opportunity to see the natural areas within the University Park undergo much needed environmental restoration along with the development of well-designed and well-managed trails that offer recreational and educational services to anyone who wants to enjoy them. At the same time, I do not know too much about environmental concerns over the use of model planes and boats in general, but I must imagine they are minimal to nonexistent and therefore, I don't see why some sort of accord couldn't be struck where these groups are allowed continued use of the land, perhaps even benefitting from upgraded facilities out there as well but these groups must show a willingness to work in collaboration with the University for the future plans of this park rather than simply opposing it so vehemontly.
smacktalk writes:
Advocate An Adventure Pass. 8^P
Rob_Dawg writes:
CSUCI needs to accept arriveste status. Their attempts to remodel the area on a neo-traditional, urban, walkable model have not been successful. No big deal. Instead, the university needs to see this second opportunity. Aviation, C^3, aerial mapping... all are leading edge areas. Technology is not a dirty subject. Embrace the modelers and build upon it. Instead of settling for a second tier teacher/sociology school status, reach for the brass ring.
smacktalk writes:
According to 5thofgen it would have negative effects on the area.
Yesterday it was all about habitat degradation.
Adventure Pass should fix it.
VC_Bike writes:
Thank you for reasonable and thoughtful comment.
One question I have however, is since the model boat and plane clubs are so concerned about being excluded, why do they themselves exclude everyone else? How is it that they are the only ones with keys to the gates? Those that are excluding everyone else don't want to be excluded themselves... Maybe what they are so concerned about is that others may treat them as they have done unto others.
drewcrewof2 writes:
The fliers are not opposing anything, no less "vehemently". Most of the planes today are electric and quiet. The club members see a few hikers and explorers from time to time but the strip occupies about 1 or 2 of the hundreds of acres available. The club has 2-300 hundred members and periodically has "fly in invites" from neighboring clubs that draw hundreds more. This area is currently being actively utilized. The issue IMHO is combating the myopic nature of environmentalist fanatics that seem to overrule everyone and everything in this liberal state of California. For over 25 years now there has been a functioning park system flourishing in this area with all interested parties working together and enjoying it with no conflicts. In comes someone with a far left wing agenda who is now going to take over and "fix" everything to their satisfaction, right? We will see...
drewcrewof2 writes:
The fliers are not excluding anyone... they do not have the power to do so. It was the county that prohibited vehicular traffic and then because the club paid for and prepared suitable parking at their site, gave them vehicular access. Why are you creating contention here where to date there has been none? The club facilities have been vandalized (badly) more than a dozen times... are you getting the idea now?
VC_Bike writes:
The idea that I get is that for the price of minimal improvements, the model clubs effectively control a significant amount of taxpayer owned real estate for their personal use.
Now would be a good time to learn how to work and play well with others.
bschatz#247641 writes:
It is not that we have are privileged, it is because we have been paying rent to the County Parks and paying for insurance to use the area. The County didn't have enough Park Rangers to open the park to the public so they had to keep it locked up. We would love to see the park opened up so more people could have equal access, we just want to be included in the park plan for the future that is all we ask.
Lets_Be_Truthful writes:
And to think the crazyness continues even after the hospital shut down. :P
bschatz#247641 writes:
VC_Bike, the reason that we and the Boat club have keys is we have been paying rent to the County and for insurance to cover our operations. We are not trying to exclude anyone, we just want CSUCI to include us in their long term plans for the park. I enjoy hiking and mountain biking with my family and there is more than enough room in the park to include those activities and more.
drewcrewof2 writes:
For some reason you seem insistent on creating conflict. Why are you so bitter? The club uses 1 acre or so of 368. Are you unhappy that you have to walk around the gate? Are you are angry because you want to drive a couple of hundred feet and park your car at the flying field and then do what? Ride a bike? Ride your bike around the gate and just keep going! No club member is blocking anyone from using this area... many do every day, Sad... you just want to fight.
DanL writes:
The CSUCI Trustees have a trust, an obligation to administer the Channel Islands Park site for ‘recreation’ for the California taxpayers who own the park, and the university, and pay their salaries. I hope they have not only a 5 year and a 10 year plan, but a 100 year plan for safekeeping this area for my grandchildren and their children. I hope the people on committees charged with developing ideas and plans are able, intelligent and far-sighted, including Prof. Rodriguez.
I have RC airplanes and enjoy flying at the field that has been operating on the site for 25 years. I enjoy walking along the roads and seeing deer, coyotes and great heron also enjoying the area. I am not aware of ‘much needed environmental restoration’ around the park. The main areas are mostly natural Southern California, with cactus, coreopsis gigantean, and other shrubs that can survive our sunshine and lack of rainfall. The exceptions are the remains of the dairy operation and some grass around the flying field that gets watered and mowed.
The only plan for the area I have heard so far is for use as additional parking for CSUCI students. That use does not further recreation on the site. It does not take advantage of any unique features of the site. It seems ‘short sighted’. I hope the caretakers of this acreage will work with the public, including model aviation enthusiasts, to create outcomes that are successful and recreational and more inspired than “overflow parking”.
bschatz#247641 writes:
One other thing we have seen over the years, and we saw it last Sunday, unfortunately when the gate is left open during the day some people with large 4 wheel drive trucks (not all) come in and drive up and down the sides of the hills, and the County was concerned that someone would damage something or get hurt and sue the County. So they always asked us to keep the gate closed and locked. But now that there is free parking at the front of the park, please come out and ride/hike around the park, there are currently no maintained trails in the park but there are some dirt roads that wind around inside the park.
VC_Bike writes:
That sounds very reasonable.
As you may have noted, in the comments on an earlier article I indicated that I thought it to be the right thing to do to continue the model club's use of the area due to your history of use.
I also believe that it should be possible for others to access the area.
The problem of vandalism is an issue for all users. One would think that a collaborative solution can be found. I hope to continue to watch the model airplanes fly by as I ride my bike or hike in the area.
saveopenspace writes:
OK...here is how it goes...the airplane model flying will be over...as soon as an EIR comes into play...no flying during breeding season, migration season, or fall, summer or winter...as you will be disturbing the birds. PERIOD...you flyer's will be out...and that is it....unfortunatly that is how it gets done....sucks.
bschatz#247641 writes:
You might be right, but our National organization (Academy of Model Aeronautics) does have studies from different bird groups that clearly show we don't negatively impact the birds. As a matter of fact there is a heron that comes out very near the runway in the morning hunting for gophers and it isn't bothered by our models. And it is kind of fun to watch it catch one every couple of days (a gopher not a model <VBG>).
drewcrewof2 writes:
Funny you should say that... I am old and like to fly big slow graceful planes in a very precision way... so it looks just like it is a real plane with passengers in it... turns me on. At least three time in the last ten years I have been attacked by one or more big black birds, diving in and either pecking the wings of my plane or stopping suddenly in the air using wide wing gestures. What I do and others, is to land (if they will let me!) and let them cool off. We really know the area and these are not local birds, just some travelling bad a--es from some distant "birdcyle" gang! The go away after a while and we can go back up and have some more fun. This is one heck of a place to enjoy... let me tell you. If you ever saw this happen you would die laughing!
saveopenspace writes:
Hi Drew...the bird folks would consider your flying "harrassment" to cause them to stop and using wide wing gestures....and for them to "attack you" you must be creating a nuisance..all of these are enviornmentalists words...not those who would find humor what you wrote...only anger...best of luck to you all in the process...just know....you have a long hard battle.
Lets_Be_Truthful writes:
Maybe the environmentalists can hire this person. I hear she is very passionate about protecting nature:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46477980?...#.T0VyWYcgd2A
Lets_Be_Truthful writes:
Lol CK!
TomcatDriver writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
combomebad writes:
Disc Golf course pleeeese!
TomcatDriver writes:
Facts are not nonsense.
Wilson writes:
The park is 370 acres. The County of Ventura acquired the Southern meadow of 236 acres from the federal government in 1985 under the Federal Lands to Parks program. The program requires “passive use” of the land. If you Google Federal Lands to Parks, it doesn’t define passive use, but it does give examples. Those include wetland restoration, hiking trails, restoration of natural vegetation – all the things the University is proposing. The examples also include hunting and horseback riding, which the University is not proposing.
What the model airplane club is finding perplexing is that when they were allowed on the property and built their facility 25 years ago, the County of Ventura had to approve that the use met the Federal Lands to Parks requirements. Obviously the County felt it did or they wouldn’t be there. Now, under those same guidelines, the University can decide that the model airplane club does not meet the requirements.
The model airplane club is hoping the University will have a broader vision for the land than they currently appear to have, and allow them to stay.
The University will be having more planning meetings. If you would like to see other forms of passive use for the land beyond what is being proposed, by all means attend the meetings or visit the University’s website for this project: http://www.csuci.edu/cipark/index.htm.
Bongo writes:
Watch California liberals take another interesting thing to do from the community.
This is another example of liberals reducing us all to video games so we can be safe from ourselves. They have created the sameness across the USA through overregulation
Camarillo is the already a very boring unimaginative place as it is. With this gone it will be even more so unless you like fast food and shopping at outlet malls.
But of course it is safe!!
This is in the same box as Ventura's liberals trying to shut down the fairground racetrack.
School potlucks and bakesales are a thing of the past thanks to liberals. They want us safe. Try and find a teeter totter or a merry go round in California. You wont the liberals took them years ago. They arent safe. Now we get the very safe liberal approved yellow plastic playgrounds. Thanks.
Boredom sloth ignorance delinquency and poverty are the natural result of being safe with a video game eating an FDA inspected Jack in Box hamburger while reading the liberal provided nutritional content.
Not all of us are into Yoga, farmers markets, wholistic therapy, and drumcircles. I liked buying tamales from the lady on the street corner that used to sell them for years. Now I cant. Thank you.
Thanks liberals you have continually strived to remake Californa so it is hopeless to do anything unless it is organic, wholistic and involves native vegetation.
It probably doesnt help our cause politically that the vast majority of the doers of these sort are conservative. We arent your constituency that is waiting for our government to make us safe.
5thgenvcresident writes:
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about nor do you seem to understand what I am talking about. I openly stated in my first post responding to this article that I am not aware of any negative effects that the model boats and airplanes have on the area, and furthermore, I would rather see a collaboration between all stakeholders involved in the future of this land: continued use by these local groups as well as improvements through trail design and environmental restoration in the park that would also benefit current and future students by providing a working laboratory to further enhance their educations.
5thgenvcresident writes:
While you are correct in noticing that there is much native vegetation in the University Park, it is also highly overrun by nonnative invasive vegetation such as giant arrundo, yellow starthistle, wild oats, castor bean, and many other species that we sometimes often overlook because we are so used to seeing them around this area. The removal efforts of these invasives and replacement using native species would serve as a great long-term effort for students at the university majoring in biology and environmental science, as well as any other students looking to get involved with restoration efforts. A successful restoration of healthy native vegetation could then improve overall ecosystem function and health, and promote more usage by local wildlife. For example, yellow starthistle highly outcompetes native milkweed species. Milkweed serves as a valuable larval food source for monarch butterflies. Removal of the starthistle and the successful return of stronger patches of milkweed could serve as a better source for monarchs to forage for food supplies. This is just one tiny example of the benefits reaped through environmental restoration.
5thgenvcresident writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
Barney writes:
The Santa Monica Mountain Conservancy encompasses 69,000 acres. Why can't the community continue long standing practices on this small portion? If you want hiking trails and native wilderness start your hike from East of University Glenn. Could it be the university wants the unwashed, uneducated masses to be diverted to a canyon before the campus?
5thgenvcresident writes:
Alright, we'll try this again: Why are you so opposed to efforts that work towards preserving/enhancing the environment? This could benefit ACTUAL students earning ACTUAL degrees in the field of science, which are not easy to obtain.
bschatz#247641 writes:
Wilson actually from the NPS Federal Lands to Parks website FAQ the land could be used for many purposes, I have copied their answer to the question below (http://www.nps.gov/ncrc/programs/flp/...):
Q. How can the land be used?
A. Land acquired through the Federal Lands to Parks Program must be used for public park and recreational use in perpetuity. It may be developed for a single recreational activity, or multiple recreation activities, or be used to support an existing park or recreation area by providing parking or improved access. It may serve as a community center, a neighborhood park, a town square, or a regional or state park. Typical recreational uses include hiking, biking, camping, picnicking, hunting, cross-country skiing, horseback riding, swimming, boating, tennis, golf, and playing organized sports. If appropriate, the land may remain undeveloped for passive recreational use, such as bird watching, photography, or wildlife conservation, as long as it is open to the public.
So there is no requirement for "passive" recreation, and Model Aviation could easily fit in the list above, all we are asking is to be included in the park plan. But from day one the park committee has been only interested in restoration, and open-space, without considering what/who is already in the park. We would be happy to work with the restoration projects as long as we can enjoy our recreation too.
Rob_Dawg writes:
• So there is no requirement for "passive" recreation, and Model Aviation could easily fit in the list above, all we are asking is to be included in the park plan. But from day one the park committee has been only interested in restoration, and open-space, without considering what/who is already in the park. We would be happy to work with the restoration projects as long as we can enjoy our recreation too.
-----
Well stated. At best the attitude so far can best be described as Luddite. There's a lack of understanding as to the broader definitions of recreation and enjoyment. Ivory tower academics are not well equipped to see the greater good. Rather than edge out the modelers I encourage the university to embrace the incredible opportunity going unrecognized. Host a Cal State University 1st annual aviation contest. Pick something, solar powered only, obstacle course, whatever and let the CS entrants fly off. Build a reputation for outreach rather than persist in the current attitude of being insular.
combomebad writes:
Thanks a lot Wilson! I just filled out the survey.. I hope this works out for everyone.
Bongo writes:
Degrees in ecology dont count as science. Sorry. Try Physics, Chemistry, Math, Biology etc. Ecology is arm waving at best, not science.
BTW Ecology degrees are easy to obtain. Theres very few jobs in it aside from govt though.
5thgenvcresident writes:
First of all, CSUCI doesn't offer a degree in Ecology. The most directly related degrees applicable to this park that they offer are Biology and Environmental Science & Resource Management. I graduated with a degree in the latter from there and in order to do so, had to complete coursework in chemistry, calculus, statistics, geographic informations systems,biology, geology, ecology, and even some economics, amongst many other rigorous courses. Additionally, the senior capstone project for the ESRM program at CSUCI is arguably one of the most, if not the most, toughest capstones to complete with very challenging requirements for graduating from the university. Math majors escape out of that school having to write a three page essay on their favorite math problem while the ESRM students have to compile scientific research papers written in the proper format and typically run 30-50 pages in length and often require up to a full year's worth of work to compile. And to top it off, my degree is a bachelor's of science degree, same as one in biology, chemistry, physics, or math. Sorry to burst your bubble bud, perhaps you should look up the requirements next time before you speak.
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